Tags:: [[Phassa]], #dhamma/advanced # (2024-02-10) How to watch the [[Phassa]]!! (Watching all 3, including the experiencer!) > [!tip] Vilas video: Practical experience of Contact or Phassa ([Youtube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msUb1Lt9seM)) > - Vilas: **==Watch all 3 together==**: The **body**, the **touch**, the **"experiencer"** (of the touch) (as in [[MN18 Madhupiṇḍikasutta]]) > [!quote] Sachin's & Vilas' comment > **Sachin**: > - My understanding of practice related to contact is this. and I also see that Vilash is trying to explain the same. > - There are two level of contacts. > - (1) tinnam sangati phasso. > - and (2) arising of duality of subject/object. or arising of observer.( phussati phasso,) > - (3)After this feeling arises in observer > - (4) and then craving(want/dont want) arise in observer. > - Now we can prepare **==practice in all this stages==**. > - **practice level 1:** to be with (3) the feeling and disassociate from reacting/craving(4). (vedana paccaya tanha). > - **pratice level 2:** be with (2) the observer and disassociate from (3) feeling. by practicing anicca, dukkha and anatta nature of feeling. > - (Note : both this level can be practices very well with goenkas method.) > - **pratice level 3:** stay in (1) and disassociate with (2 the observer). and realise that there is only seeing,hearing,touching and tasting.... there is no Me/the-vinnana. but in this even the object disappear. as by product. > - Practice level 3 is almost like turiya or **deep sleep**. > > **Vilas:** > - Yes > - https://youtu.be/gSWs-_2FCo8?si=_Pjafay7UC9WR1Hw > - This is a video from Jiddu Krishnamurti on the same subject > - Sachin who is UK wanted to know how to be an observer without the observer > - **karta** - no doer > - **Na bhokta** - no experiencer or enjoyer > > **Sachin:** > - Nice one. Trick is to observe as if u dont know. And **rest in not knowingness**. Relief from knowing. > - Even in formal sitting meditation i observed that 'how to meditate' always arise. And disturbs. > - And i found it more peaceful to just rest in **=='i dont know how to meditate'==** 😀 > [!tip] Eryu's thoughts #eryu/insight/practice > **Eryu:** > - I was contemplating on this.. May I understand these 3 levels of practice as **==giving up the "craving" at 3 different levels==**? > - **practice level 1:** Giving up the craving to "react" to the feeling — as in, the craving in "vedana -> tanha -> upadana" > - **practice level 2:** Giving up the craving which "resulted" in the feeling in the first place — as in, the craving in "tanha -> vedana" > - **practice level 3:** Giving up the craving to "be any experiencer" at all — Maybe some kind of bhavatanha? (not sure if the terminology is correct) > - And the reason why **breath is easy/good for meditation** is because the level 1 and 2 craving doesn't exist at all (since breath has a neutral feeling), so it's easier to **directly go to the level 3 practice** and let go of the craving there. Is that right?